Recitation of Ameen Loudly Behind Imam

[fayaz.hs]

taken from Alahazrat.net - Islam - Namaz - Quran - Hamd o Naat - Speeches - Books - Article

Recitation of Ameen Loudly Behind Imam

When we perform our Salaah behind the Imam and he recites“Waladdaalleen” loudly we say Amin quietly. This is because Amin is a dua and it should always be read quietly. Some people say thatwhen performing Salaah behind the Imam you should say Amin loudly with rhythm.

We argue that there is no such Hadith, which mentions that, the Prophet (May Allah bless him and grant him peace) ordered this action and He (May Allah bless him and grant him peace) never encouraged anyone to do this.

The people who follow this action put forward one Hadith, which says that the Prophet (May Allah bless him and grant him peace) said Amin loudly in the Salaah.
We claim that it is true by saying that the Prophet (May Allah bless him and grant him peace) said Amin loudly a few times. The Prophet used to carry out actions only to educate people, for example, in Salaah-ul-Zuhr part of the Qur’an was recited loudly.

Imam Bukhari and Imam Muslim write:

When the Prophet (May Allah bless him and grant him peace) was performing his Zuhr and Asr prayers, he recited part of the Qur’an loudly, which we could hear. (Bukhari and Muslim, chapter on Qiraat, Zuhr and Asr)

After reading this Hadith no one in the whole Ummah says that the Imam should recite any part of the Qur’an loudly in the Zuhr and Asr Salaah. This is because everyone knows that the Prophet (May Allah bless him and grant him peace) only did this to educate the people. In the same way, the Hadith that mentions that the Prophet (May Allah bless him and grant him peace) said Amin loudly does not mean that it is Sunnah to say Amin loudly. There is also proof from the Qur’an and Sunnah that Amin should be said quietly behind the Imam.

Proof from the Qur’an to say Amin quietly behind the Imam

Hafidh Ibn Kathir writes:

When someone finishes reciting surat-ul-Fatiha, it is preferable to say Amin.
Amin means “Oh Allah, accept our du’a”

There is proof from the Qur’an that Amin is a du’a. For example, Allah Ta’ala says in the Qur’an that Prophet Musa (May Allah be pleased with Him) prayed to Allah by saying: "Oh Allah, destroy the wealth of Pharaoh" (Surah Yunus: Verse 87)
The Prophet Musa’ brother Haroon (May Allah be pleased with Him) was standing beside him and said Amin. Allah accepted their du’a by saying: "I except both of your du’as" (Surah Yunus: 89)

The Prophet Musa (May Allah be pleased with Him) supplicated to Allah whereas Haroon only said Amin. But Allah attributed the du’a to both of them.
This proves that Amin is a du’a.(Tafsir Ibn Kathir. Under Surah Fatihah)
Qadhi Shawkani and Imam Qurtubi also write, in the interpretation of Surah Fatihah, that Amin is a du’a.
(Qurtabi and Fathul Qadeer under surah Fatiha)

Now that it has been proved that Amin is a dua, we should supplicate quietly to Allah. Proof from the Qur’an and Sunnah show that du’a should be recited quietly.

Proof from the Qur’an and Sunnah that du’a should be recited quietly

Allah Ta’ala says in the Qur’an:
“Invoke your lord with humility and in secret. He likes not the aggressors.” (Surah al-a’raf: 55)

It is proved from the above verse that all should supplicate to Allah with humility and secrecy.

Allah says in the Qur’an:
“And remembering your lord by your tongue and within yourself, humbly and with fear without loudness in words.”
(Surah al-a’raf: 205)

Qadhi Shawkaani writes:
In the above verse the word “remember” means du’a and du’a should be said secretly.
(Fath ul qadeer. Under verse 205 Surah al-a’raf)

Allah Ta’ala says in the Qur’an:
“This is a mention of mercy of your Lord to his slave Zakariyya. When he called out his Lord (Allah) – a call in secret.
(Surah Maryam: 2-3)

Proof from Hadith for doing du’a secretly

Imam Ahmad Ibn Hanbal writes:
The Prophet (May Allah bless him and grant him peace) said that Allah Ta’ala is pleased with those who remember him secretly.
(Musnad Ahmad, narration of Saad bin Abi Waqqaas, volume 1 p.172)

It is proven from the Qur’an and Sunnah that du’a should be supplicated to Allah quietly and as Amin is also a du’a so it should be said quietly also. That is the reason why all du’as are read silently. For example Thanaa, Takbeer, Ta’awwudh, Tasbeeh, Tashahhud, salutation and the final sitting’s du’a are all read silently, so Amin should also be included in the above. The reason why the Imam says the Takbeer loudly is only to inform his followers that he is moving from one position to another.

Proof from Hadith to say Amin quietly

Imam Muslim and Imam Bukhari write:
The Prophet (May Allah bless him and grant him peace) said that when the Imam says “Waladdaalleen”then you must say Amin because the Angels also say Amin and whosoever’s Amin coincides with that of an Angel, their past sins will be forgiven.
(Bukhai and Muslim Chapter on Ta’meen)

There are two ways in which Amin can be similar to the angels’ Amin:
1) To say Amin with the Imam
2) To say Amin silently because the angels say Amin with the Imam and also silently.
If someone proclaims Amin loudly it would not be similar to the Angels’ as no one hears the Angels.

Imam Muslim writes:
Abu Hurairah reported that the Prophet (May Allah bless him and grant him peace) said that when the Imam says “Sami’allaahu liman Hamidah” you should say “Rabbanaa lakal Hamd”. Whoever’s Tahmeed becomes similar to the Angels’, their past sins would be forgiven.(Muslim Bab Ta’meen)

The Hadith of Amin and Tahmeed are written under the same chapter.
Both of these Hadith mention that whosoever’s Amin or Tahmeed coincides with that of the Angels’ their past sins will be forgiven. It is clear now that Amin should be said as “Rabbanaa lakal hamd” i.e. silently and individually, without rhythm.

Imam Nasaa’ee writes:
The Prophet (May Allah bless him and grant him peace) said that when the Imam says “Waladdaalleen”, you should say “Amin”. This is because the angels and the Imam also say Amin. Whosoever’s Amin coincides with the Angels’, his past sins would be forgiven.(Nasaa’ee, Ibn Maajah, Daarimi, chapter Tahmeed, musnad Ahmad narration of Abu Hurairah)

This Hadith proves that Amin should be said as the Imam says his Amin. No one hears the Imam’s Amin, so no one should hear the follower’s Amin. The Prophet (May Allah bless him and grant him peace) has also ordered us to follow the Imam, so we should say Amin quietly.


One doubt

Some people claim that the Imam should say Amin loudly.
Imam Dar Qutni writes:
Wyle said that the Prophet (May Allah bless him and grant him peace) led the Salaah and read Amin loudly. (Tirmidhi and Dar Qutni, chapter Ta’meen)
This Hadith provides evidence that Amin should be said loudly. There is also another


Hadith which Imam Dar Qutni wrote:
It is reported by Abu Hurairah that The Prophet (May Allah bless him and grant him peace) led the Salaah and said Amin loudly. (Dar Qutni, chapter Ta’meen)
There is also a third Hadith which is reported by Umm Haseen:
She said that the Prophet (May Allah bless him and grant him peace) read the Salaah and said Amin loudly.(Zalee, Chapter on Ta’meen)


All the above narrations prove that the Imam should say Amin loudly and the followers should also say Amin loudly.


We clear this doubt by saying
· That Bukhari or Muslim did not write the above narrations.
· Secondly, all these narrations prove that the Imam says Amin loudly sometimes.
· Thirdly, the Prophet (May Allah bless him and grant him peace) said Amin loudly sometimes.
· Fourthly, the Prophet (May Allah bless him and grant him peace) said Amin loudly so that his followers would know that after “Waladdaalleen”, “Amin” should be said.
· Fifthly, these narrations cannot be used as evidence because they are not authentic.

Examining the Narrators


The first narrator was called Muhammad bin Kathir.

Imam Dhahabi and Hafidh Asqalani write:
Imam Ahmad said that Muhammad bin Kathir is weak. Imam Nasaa’ee said that he is not reliable in the science of Hadith. Abdullah bin Ahmad said that he narrates false narrations of Hadith, which is why the scholars of Hadith reject his narrations and say that Muhammad bin Kathir is weak. Imam Bukhari, Imam Abu Dawood, Imam Salih, and Hafidh Jazrah say that he made many mistakes in his narrations, all his narrations are weak and that his narrations are difficult to understand. Imam Ibn Adhi mentions his unknown narrations in his book Kamil. Imam Ibn Habbaan said Muhammad bin Kathir is authentic but made many mistakes. Imam Laith and Ibn Mu’een praised him.
(Meezan ul I’tidaal, Tahdheeeb-ut-tahdheeb, biography of Muhammad bin Kathir)


The other narrator of these narrations is Muhammad bin Khalid.
Imam Dhahabi and Hafidh Asqalani write:
Muhammad is a truthful man but is unknown. Imam Ibn Abi Khatim said that I asked my Father about Muhammad but he replied that he was unaware of his existence.
(Meezaan ul I’tidaal, biography of Muhammad bin Khalid)


Another narrator of these narrations is called Abdul Jabbar bin Wyle.

[fayaz.hs]

Re: Ameen

Hafidh Asqalani writes:
Imam Bukhari, Imam Tirmidhi and Imam ibn Habbaan said that bin Wyle had never heard any Hadith from his Father. The other scholars of Hadith say that he was born after his Father's death that is why it’s not possible that he would have heard any Hadith from his Father. Imam Ibn Sa’ad said that ibn Wyle has only narrated a few Hadith.
(Tahdheeb ut-tahdheeb, biography of Abdul Jabbar bin Wyle)

Abdul Jabbaar’s narrations cannot be used as evidence because he said that he narrated directly from his Father whereas his Father had died before his birth.
Is-haaq bin Ibrahim az Zubedi was another narrator of these narrations

Imam Dhahabi writes:
Imam Dawood and Imam Nasaaee said that he had no knowledge of Hadith and he was not authentic. Imam Atee said that he was a liar.(Meezaan ul I’tidaal, biography of Is-haaq bin Ibraaheem uz Zubaidi)

Another narrator of these narrations is called Abdullah bin Salim.
Imam Dhahabi writes:
He was a NAasbee (from a misled sect), Abdullah bin Salim contempted Hadrat Ali (Radiall hu anhu) and he used to say that Hadrat Ali (Radiall hu anhu) helped those people who killed Hadrat Abu Bakr (Radiall hu anhu) and Hadrat Umar (Radiall hu anhu).
(Meezaan ul ‘itidaal, biography of Abdullah bin Salim)

Another narrator of these narrations is Ismail bin Muslim Makkee.
Imam Dhahabi and Hafidh Asqalani write:
Imam Ahmad, Imam Abu Zurah, Imam Nasaaee, Imam Ali, and Imam Bukhari say that he is weak and that he narrates unknown Hadith. This is why the scholars of Hadith began to avoid his narrations. Imam ibn Mo’een said that he combined the text from one Hadith into another.
(Meezaan ul I’tidaal, tahdheeb ut-tahdheeb, biography of Isma’il bin Muslim Makkee)

How can the above narrations be used as evidence when the narrators of these Ahadith have been highly criticized by the scholars of Hadith. The Ahadith that have been narrated by these narrators cannot be authentic; they can only prove that “Amin” is to be said loudly by the Imam, not that the followers say Amin loudly together with the Imam. If this was the case, the narrators of these Ahadith who are the companions of the Prophet (May Allah bless him and grant him peace) should have said “When the Prophet (May Allah bless him and grant him peace) said Amin loudly, we also said Amin loudly. But they only reported that the Prophet said Amin loudly.

It is established that the Imam says Amin loudly sometimes. The way of the companions was to follow this and to listen to the Amin quietly, not to read Amin loudly themselves. Secondly, there are other Ahadith that mention that the Prophet (May Allah bless him and grant him peace) used to say Amin silently.

Imam Ibn Abi Shaibah writes:
Wyle reported that he performed Salaah behind the Prophet (May Allah bless him and grant him peace) and he said Amin silently.
(Musannaf ibn Abee Shaiba. Chapter Ta’meen)

Imam Ahmad bin Hanbal writes:
Wyle reported that the Prophet (May Allah bless him and grant him peace) led the Salaah and said Amin silently.
(Musnad Ahmad bin Hambal, narrations of Wyle bin Hajjar)

Both of the above narrations prove that when the Prophet (May Allah bless him and grant him peace) led the Salaah, he said Amin silently.

Imam Abu Dawood writes:
When the Prophet (May Allah bless him and grant him peace) led the Salaah, after saying “Waladdaalleen”, he became silent.
(Abu Dawood. Chapter Al Qiraa’t)

The above narration proves that when the Prophet (May Allah bless him and grant him peace) became silent, it was to say Amin silently. If the Prophet (May Allah bless him and grant him peace) was to say Amin loudly then, there was no point in Him remaining silent after saying “Waladdaalleen”.

Let us now examine the evidence of those people who say Amin loudly behind the Imam.

First Evidence
Imam Bukhari writes:
Ata bin Rubah said that “Amin” is a du’a. Abd Allah and the people who were behind him said Amin loudly and this sound echoed throughout the masjid.
(Bukhari. Chapter on ta’meen)

They conclude from this Hadith that Amin should be said loudly so that the sound echoes throughout the masjid. We argue that although this narration is written in Bukhari, but he did not write the chain of this narration. Imam Bukhari was born at the very end of the 2nd century after Hijrah and Abdullah bin Zubair died in the 73rd year of Hijrah. This means that Imam Bukhari was born 125 years after the death of Abdullah bin Zubair. How could Bukhari know that the masjid echoed with the sound of Amin, at the time of Abdullah bin Zubair?

Ta’leeq (To Suspend)
When a scholar of Hadith writes a Hadith without mentioning the chain between himself and the Prophet (May Allah bless him and grant him peace), or he mentions a little part of the chain, a Hadith such as this is called Hadith Mu’allaq (suspended Hadith). This is because this type of Hadith is chain-less. The scholars of Hadith call it a suspended Hadith.

Hafidh Asqalani writes:
When a scholar of Hadith writes a chainless Hadith directly from the Prophet (May Allah bless him and grant him peace) or from a companion, or a student of a companion, this type of narration is not accepted because he never met the companion of the Prophet (May Allah bless him and grant him peace) or the companion’s student. It is not known whether the narrators, which he does not mention, are authentic or weak. The majority of scholars of Hadith agree that if a scholar, who writes a chainless Hadith, claims that the narrators are authentic, his claim will not be accepted until he mentions their names. Both Muslim and Bukhari contain some chain-less Hadith which cannot be accepted.
(Sharh un nukhbah and muqaddamah Fath ul Baari. Chapter on Hadith Mu’allaq by Hafidh Asqalani)

According to the majority of scholars chainless narrations are not acceptable. Ibn Zubair’s above narration is a chain-less narration and so it cannot be accepted as evidence. Secondly, it is not clear from Ibn Zubair’s narration if the followers said “Amin” after “Waladdaalleen” or during the du’a in the Fajr Salaah. It is also not clear if the followers in the Salaah said Amin in all their Salaah or just once. Thirdly, it doesn’t say that the Prophet ordered to say Amin. The above mentioned Hadith cannot be used to prove that Amin should be said behind the Imam.

Second Evidence
Imam Ibn Majah wries:
Bishar bin Rafir said that Abu Hurairah’s cousin Abu Abdullah told me that he heard Abu Hurairah saying that the people have stopped saying Amin although the Prophet (May Allah bless him and grant him peace) used to say Amin after Waladdaalleen. The people in the first row offering Salaah could hear him. The sound echoed throughout the masjid.
(Ibn Maajah, Chapter Ta’meen)

Examination of the narrators
The first narrator of this narration is Abu Abdullah.
Imam Dhahabi writes:
He is Abu Hurairah’s cousin, but is unknown. Imam Bukhari and Imam Muslim did not take this narration from him.
(Meezaan ul I’tidaal, biography of Abu Abdullah)

The second narrator is Bishar bin Rafir.
Imam Dhahabi and Hafidh Asqalani write:
Imam Bukhari said that no one could verify his narration. Imam Ahmad said that his narrations are weak and he has no knowledge of Hadith. Imam Yahya bin Mo’een said that his narrations are unknown. Imam Nisaaee said that he is not strong in the knowledge of Hadith. Imam Ibn Habbaan said that he narrates false Ahadith. Imam Abu Khatim and Imam Tirmidhi say that he is weak and that he narrates unknown Hadiths. This is the reason why his narrated Ahadiths are weak. Imam ibn Abdul Barr said that all the scholars of Hadith agree that all his narrations should be thrown away. The scholars of Hadith did not accept his narrations. Imam Bukhari and Muslim did not take any narrations from him. There were the only two or three people who praised him.
(Meezaan ul I’tidaal, tahdheeb ut tahdheeb, biography of Bishar bin Rafir il Harsee)

The above statements show that the narrators of these narrations have been highly criticized by the scholars of Hadith.

The Text of Hadith
Abu Hurairah said that the people had stopped saying Amin.

Abu Hurairah was a famous companion of the Prophet (May Allah bless him and grant him peace) and he died in 59 AH. He complained that the people had stopped saying Amin. In his time, a large number of the companions were alive, if it was a sunnah to say Amin loudly behind the Imam, then the companions would have done so and Abu Hurairah needn’t have complained.

Abu Hurairah saw this in the time of the Kulafa but did not mention that they, or their followers used to say Amin loudly; it has been proven that the khulafa and their followers did not practice this.

Abu hurairah continued to say that when the Prophet (May Allah bless him and grant him peace) used to say Amin, the people in the first row heard it and the sound echoed throughout the masjid.
This statement proves that the Prophet (May Allah bless him and grant him peace) used to say Amin sometimes to teach the people, but the people behind him did not say Amin loudly and that

The following sentence “The sound echoed throughout the masjid” requires attention because the sound can only echo if the place is made of cement and also has a dome. The roof of the masjid, at the time of the Prophet (May Allah bless him and grant him peace), was made from palm-tree branches and no cement was used. This means that it is not possible for the sound to have echoed throughout the masjid. The interesting thing is that Imam Dawood also wrote this narration in his chapter on ta’meen, but did not mention the above words (i.e.
“The sound echoed throughout the masjid”).

The above narration is not authentic and the text does not prove that Amin should be said loudly behind the Imam. This is because in the whole narration there is no proof that the companions of the Prophet (May Allah bless him and grant him peace) used to say Amin loudly behind the Imam.

[Sufiyan Shaikh]

subhan Allah..........very informative

[fayaz.hs]

BarakAllah Bhai..

[rabz]

jazakallah

[abdulmadarbux]

JazakAllah for the Hadith Mubarak. I did not know the Hadith but I was taught by my Madrasah teacher to say AMIN QUIETLY in Salat behind the Imaam. I still do even all the other 'Musalli' are saying it loudly.

[fayaz.hs]

BarakAllah Bhai... I have seen lot of muslim brothers saying ameen loudly... If the namazee who is following Hanafi methode he should say ameen quitly, if he say's it loudly the will be maqroo...

[fayaz.hs]

view this Video Clip
YouTube - Authentic Hadith Proof on Saying Aameen * Silently * Ref:Sunnan Tirimdhi

[fayaz.hs]

Great Knowledge of Dr Zakir Naik About saying ameen with loud voice...???

Zakir Naik says that there are many Ahadith in Bukhari where Prophet Mohammad (صلى الله عليه و آله وسلم) said that we should say "Ameen" with a loud voice during Salah after Sura Fatiha.

This is a blatant lie. There is only one Hadith in Bukhari in this context, which does not say that we should say 'Ameen' loudly. Therefore, the ruling of Imam Abu Hanifa that we should say Ameen slowly after Sura Fatiha cannot be viewed as wrong.

Zakir Naik also claims that Imams of Fiqh did not have enough knowledge and were not aware of all Ahadith during their life times.

This is a serious allegation on the most acclaimed Imams of fiqh by a person like Zakir Naik who has not studied Islamic subjects in any Islamic school in the world.

View this Video Clip.....
YouTube - Great Knowledge of Dr Zakir Naik - Part 1 of 2

[bint-e-anwar]

jazzak Allah Fayaz Bhai for ur good effort in explaining the point

[fayaz.hs]

BarakAllah Sis

[abdulmadarbux]

Fayaz Bhai, I sincerely agreed with you.
When I was a child and young adult in my country The Masjid I used to go was the "Hanafi" Ahle Sunnat Wal Jammat one, and no one was saying "Ameen" loudly after the Imaam had finished Sura Al-Fatihah.
It is here in England that any Masjid you go they say "Ameen" loudly except the Pakistani Masjid. But as travelling, distance and weather conditions prevent me from going to the Pakistani Masjid, I have to go to any local Masjid, but as I said before I say "my Ameen" quietly. (As a matter of interest I make special effort to go the Pakistani Masjid when there is Milad un Nabi).

[_knownothing_]

in the all arab world they say it loudly
we should keep in the mind islam spread form makkah and madinah
how can ppl living hear make mistake i am not saying they are angels but keep in the mind this is the origin of islam ..these are the places form where islam is spread problem with us is that we follow only our murshidis don't read and don't open our mind

how can we doubt immam-e-kaba

[_knownothing_]

[COLOR= if he say's it loudly the will be maqroo...[/COLOR]

.how can u say this ........... what about all arab ummah u think their is maqroo may Allah subhanwataala guide me if i am wrong

[fayaz.hs]

.how can u say this ........... what about all arab ummah u think their is maqroo may Allah subhanwataala guide me if i am wrong

Sis if u r following the Hanfi way of salath then u hc to say Ameen Silently, if ur following Shafi way of salath then u say it Loudly...
I said makru to the 1 who is following Hanfi Masnath n saying Ameen Loudly...